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 Post subject: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Browning...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:33 pm 
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Quite a significant news for the CF.

http://blogs.ottawacitizen.com/2011/09/ ... -handguns/

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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 7:34 am 
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Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 4:30 pm
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Location: Norfolk, VA
That is big news since the BHP has been the standard since before WW2 eh?

It is a great pistol even today. My house gun is an old Belgian Browning 9 HP.

Hopefully the pistol you all go to will be a versatile 9mm like the H&K P2000 style.

If they are replacing the Sig P5 or 225, they will probably not go to the P229 style.....anything but a Glock.......please.

Good luck to you. Colt Canada still rolling along in spite of their US Ownership.


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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:22 am 
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Why the "anything but a Glock" comment?

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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 7:59 pm 
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Location: Norfolk, VA
I was on a test team back in 1988-89 when the Glock 17 and 19 were being tested at Crane.

Some personnel were issued Glock 19's for use in the PI just after Col Nick Rowe was ambushed and killed by the NPA.

I wanted to carry a SIG P228 preproduction pistol, but was told to carry the Glock 19. Qualed with it fine and Glock set us up with spare mags, plastic holsters & a quick armorer's course with enough spare parts to build 5 extra guns.

When we were in country for 2 months, we were given the opportunity to fire quals with a local Military unit and the Naval Special Warfare Det at Subic before Pinatubo blew its top. All of our Glock 19's suffered from single shot syndrome, where the slide lock locked back with every round. We called BS on this ASAP and called the President of GLOCK USA at his home. He said to send the weapons back for replacement...........I guess we were going to draw new sidearms out of thin air.........One of the SEAL Warrants looked at the weapon and found that the spring on the slide lock was causing the problem.....a simple fix.....we thought.

We threw all the Glock trash in a box and sent it back to Georgia with a courier in a MAC flight with orders. We had to draw Ruger 357 and Smith model 36's with 38 ball ammo to protect ourselves. We ended up borrowing CAR15's and 870 whippets from the Embassy through a friend at the MSG's and the ARSO.

When we rotated home, the glock 19's were all there with all sorts of Glock SWAGG and an apology letter.......we turned them in to Crane with a bad write up. We were issued SIG P226 and P228's after that. Glock offered us "special deals" on Glock 17L's, 17's and 19's......but no one took them up on it. It was a shame since they started out with a great program.

Never liked the Glocks for a weapon I had to bet my life on. I've had to carry the M9, Mk24, M11 and even a Mk 23 for a week........just lost the faith in Glocks.

I did fire a modified Glock 17 set up by the Norwegian SF for suppressors (fired without a suppressor) which was a very dependable pistol out of 500 rounds fired.......but I still could not get over those failures from earlier experience. I guess I'm still P'oed.

Personal preference, but with a lot of hard facts & bad experience behind them.

People like them, I don't.

I prefer a H&K USP 45C or SIG P228 if I have to carry on my permit, depending on clothing choices.


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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:19 pm 
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Not want to talk you into using Glock, not that I could anyhow, but since the first Glocks a lot have changed. I have the same hate relationship (as there is nothing to love) with the M9. The first M9s we got (yes I'm an old fart) were only good for one failed shot and a aimed throw. Still think DoD went for this Browning Hi-Power wannabee out of political considerations.

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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:43 pm 
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Based on the requirements in the tender, the Glock is not an option:

Quote:
-The GSP must be full size, semi-automatic Double Action Only (DAO).
-The GSP must be in current use within NATO and has been in service for a minimum of two years.
-The GSP must fire all 9mm ammunition that complies with requirements of (STANAG-4090) Small Arms Ammunition (9mm Parabellum).
-The grip size must be adjustable to permit the 5th percentile Canadian female to the 95th percentile Canadian male easily perform all operations and easily hold and fire the GSP
-The trigger must not be required to be depressed as part of the disassembly process.
-The GSP must not have any external safety device that requires separate manipulation by the user in order to fire.
-The GSP must be able to fire and remove a cartridge from the chamber with the magazine removed from the GPS. (No magazine disconnect/safety)


I have a love-hate relationship with the Glock, sometimes it's a match made in heaven and I hit everything. Other times I can't hit a lake, even if I was on the bottom. It's wierd....


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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:45 pm 
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A weapon is only as good as the shooter behind it. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 12:34 am 
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Yeah, I hear ya.

I have improved my technique in the last year, so shooting more consistently now. But still, I like my CZ 75 SP01 better. And I shoot better with that gun.


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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:46 am 
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As the placement of the hand on a Glock is a little different from a lot of other pistols you could try a Grip Force Adapter. This would change the angle of the grip and thus get a more familiar grip on the weapon. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 4:04 am 
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Seems the deck is stacked for either the SIG series modified for DAO and H&K USP.......I don't know if anyone is using a Compact USP in NATO.......Only the Germans are using the full size USP and they can add a LEM unit.....which sucks to me.....I don't think it will meet the female demographic though. I can't think of anyone in NATO that doesn't issue the GLOCK or SIG and maybe the H&K.

I thought that the Glock Safe Action was considered a DOUBLE Action for the sake of arguement since the striker is not prestaged and the pull weight could be set from 3# though 10#. I would have to defer to the Glock experts.

Back to the M9........I met the two guys at Beretta USA who came up with the slide capture device.....i.e. large hammer pin........that was a terrible idea to adopt that pistol that breaks into little pieces and destroys the frame in the process. I used to have a jar filled with broken locking pieces for the Navy M9's, even the upgraded locks with radiused cuts. The US still bought Millions of bucks more of them.......but the price is stil less than $200 each.

Maybe I'm being a bitch about handguns, but I dont have to settle for taking what is issued anymore. I only wish they issued the troops the best money could buy.....I think they deserve that much.

A friend in a Government Agency saw this post and he reminded me that SF units have the option of issuing the Glock for certain missions and it has been tested, approved and fielded in all current conflict areas without a problem........so I;ll leave it at that.


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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:42 pm 
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Well well...

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Milita ... story.html

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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 7:43 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2009 12:13 am
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Logsu1 wrote:
I don't know if anyone is using a Compact USP in NATO.......


Yeah, Spanish SOF (Grupos de Operaciones Especiales - GOE) are using Compacts in Afghanistan.


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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 8:42 pm 
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To the best of my knowledge, the French Navy are the only military forces using the USP Compact in particular within NATO. Heard about the use of the HK45 Compact etc, but for the plain USPc it is mostly specialized police forces.

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 Post subject: Re: Canadian Forces To Receive New Pistol to Replace Brownin
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:18 pm 
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Some German Naval Forces also use it afair

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