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 Post subject: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle Shot
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:15 pm 
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The Army and Marine Corps may soon field a lighter combat helmet with nearly double the bullet and blast protection of the current Advanced Combat Helmet.

Army officials said that recent tests of the so-called "Enhanced Combat Helmet" showed the helmets were so strong that engineers didn't have equipment powerful enough to penetrate them with simulated IED fragments.

"The test lab we sent it to couldn't calculate an [average ballistic rating] because … the test guns they had couldn't shoot fragments fast enough to penetrate the helmet," said the Army's top protective equipment buyer, Col. Bill Cole. "We don't know exactly what the [average strength] is, but it's better than we've ever seen before."

Read the rest here: http://www.military.com/news/article/ne ... SRC=dod.nl

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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:13 am 
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Quote:
so well, officials say, that some types of 7.62 rifle rounds can be fired point-blank at the helmet without going through.


That is SICK , more ligth helmet and more protection that's wath soldiers needs! they should Use that material, make body armor, now the question is .. how you can drill a NVM holes on the helmet :lol: ??


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:14 pm 
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What might be an issue is temperature, usually plastics of any kind are susceptible to temperature (I don't know if it is the case with thermoplastics like this one) so the average heat in the middle east might weaken the material a bit.


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:40 am 
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That's all well and good, but I still don't understand what they plan to do about the severe neck injuries that will still likely occur from being shot in the head.

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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:55 am 
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That's incredible! @ echothreesierra, at least they can still worry about the neck injury after being shot in the head...


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:03 am 
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What kind of "equipment" are they using to test the effects of IED fragments?


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:40 pm 
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There is not enough momentum in the bullet to cause a neck injury.

There have been numerous saves in theatre from rifle rounds, with standard ACH helmets, Ops Core FAST and Airframe helmets, with the wearers of said helmets not suffering neck/C-Spine injuries.

A few numbers:

1. Baseball bat being swung

Speed: 68.9 f/s (21 m/s)
Mass: 30oz (850 grams)
Momentum: 17.85kg m/s

2. Baseball being struck

Speed: 133 f/s (40.5 m/s)
Mass: 11.6 oz (330 grams)
Momentum: 13.46kg m/s

3. .308 projectile

Speed: 2820 f/s (860 m/s)
Mass: 150 grains (9.7 grams)
Momentum: 8.4kg m/s

Let's look at the Kinetic Energy of the different objects:

K= 1/2MV2

1. Baseball bat being swung:

K= 187 J

2. Baseball being struck:

K= 271 J

3. .308 projectile:

K= 3590 J


Last edited by AGR416 on Fri Jun 15, 2012 3:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:28 pm 
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I thought the 'broken neck death by a bullet on the helmet' thing was a dead myth by now.

Ok, well, theoretically it's not 'completely' implausible, but it's still not something to consider seriously. Say the chance of a soldier dying of a brocken neck by a bullet on his helmet would be something like less than 1%? It's not worth sacrificing any other vital aspects of a ballistic helmet.

The common part 2 of this myth is 'So you should better unfasten your chinstrap because when shot, the helmet would fly off your head and save your neck'

Seriously, would you want to unfasten your chinstrap with all that shit(NVG, mount, shroud, light, IR device, counterweight, the shell itself) on your head?


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:57 pm 
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AGR416 wrote:
There is not enough momentum in the bullet to cause a neck injury.

There have been numerous saves in theatre from rifle rounds, with standard ACH helmets, Ops Core FAST and Airframe helmets, with the wearers of said helmets not suffering neck/C-Spine injuries.

A few numbers:

1. Baseball bat being swung

Speed: 68.9 f/s (21 m/s)
Mass: 30oz (850 grams)
Momentum: 17.85kg m/s

2. Baseball being struck

Speed: 133 f/s (40.5 m/s)
Mass: 11.6 oz (330 grams)
Momentum: 13.46kg m/s

3. .308 projectile

Speed: 2820 f/s (860 m/s)
Mass: 150 grains (9.7 grams)
Momentum: 3.8kg m/s

Let's look at the Kinetic Energy of the different objects:

K= 1/2MV2

1. Baseball bat being swung:

K= 187 J

2. Baseball being struck:

K= 271 J

3. .308 projectile:

K= 3590 J


Thanks AGR, that's an interesting comparison. Learn something new everyday. Just one of those things you always hear and never really give too much thought to I suppose.

And shellshocker, I never said anything about unbuckling your chin strap. Personally, I have just simply always looked at being shot in the head as kind of an occupational hazard. Sort of like a cop wearing vest, but realizing the fact that if he gets shot in the head he's likely going to die isn't going to prevent him from going out on the beat.

That's not to say that I'm not for more head protection, or that I don't value my own life, but up until now (and I'm sure a lot of other guys kind of feel this way as well), helmets were only rated to stop pistol rounds and frag. You just kind of accepted that fact and carried on about your business.

When I write it down in words and read it, I know it doesn't really make any sense to a logical person and will probably even draw some backlash, but its just kind of a "whatever" for me. I think all of these ballistic mandibles and shit are stupid.

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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:24 pm 
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Current tech helmets are actually better against oblique hits from rifle rounds, than no helmet.

Also, while I agree that mandibles have a limited role for dismounted troops, for top cover/turret gunners, they are probably a huge asset.


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:02 pm 
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based on my little knowledge and experience of shooting cars, I would assume all the numbers above would indicated a perpendicular or 90 degree, dead on hit in which all energy was transferred to helmet, then head. and with those numbers I see a very bad neck injury or your brain bouncing around in the skull like a pinball game. BUT add some degree offsets in there and you'll see a huge drop in numbers. much less energy will be transferred to helmet and instead will be used in redirection of bullet. shooting into and out off windshields is an artform I've been practicing in for some time


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:43 pm 
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What is more likely to break your neck or cause cervical injuries; the bat, the baseball or the bullet?

How can you say that a perpendicular hit from a bullet to the head will cause neck/spinal injuries, when there clearly is not enough momentum to cause that amount of injury? The kinetic energy of the bullet is irrelevant. It won't suddenly cause the head to go from a stand still, to super fast speeds breaking the neck. That is momentum, and the numbers are there.

The physics do not lie.

In another thread, about bullet proof vests, I posted a video demoing a guy taking a .308 at point blank range in the abdomen while wearing rifle proof body armor. Not an inch of movement.

How is that suddenly not the case when struck in the head?

Yes, the offset is important in regards to trauma from BFD, but if it does not penetrate it does not penetrate.

Will it hurt? Probably like a motherfucker. Will you go down from the surprise of being hit? Most likely. However, that is NOT from the bullet impacting the helmet, that is a result of the wearer being freaked the fuck out.

And how exactly does shooting windshields transfer over to inelastic collisions between projectiles and helmets?


ETA:

An example for you:

Quote:
The momentum of the so-called "manstopper" .45 ACP bullet is approximately that of a 1 pound (0.45 kg) mass dropped from a height of 11.4 feet (3.5 m).


The same .308 will equate to throwing a 2kg crowbar at 4m/s at a guy wearing a helmet. If that does not break the guy's neck, the bullet will not either.

ETA 2:

Watch the clip in this link:

http://soldiersystems.net/2012/05/24/i- ... -about-it/

Read the comments.


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:34 pm 
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Some more numbers:

After the collsion of the .308 and the helmet, the head will move at a speed of 1,7 m/s, if the head and helmet weighs 5kgs combined. That equals a speed of 6km/h, the equivalent of moving at a brisk pace into a wall head first while wearing a helmet.

Not nearly enough to break the neck, but a good impact.

Also, after the KE has been used to do other work, like produce heat, sound and to deform the helmet material, there is approximatly 7J left.


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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:10 pm 
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This has been a really interesting read. Hard to argue with any of that.

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 Post subject: Re: "Enhanced Combat Helmet" New Combat Helmet Blocks Rifle
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:41 pm 
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i was like, theres no way! im not physicist but i thought i was pretty good at it (at least in school i was!) but i bow to your knowledge....

i was like Theres NO WAY! but after watching an hour of videos of guys getting shot in the head, i was like WOW, i was way off!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y0g6PNqBiI


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