It is currently Sat May 27, 2017 3:14 am


All times are UTC + 1 hour




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:01 pm 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:42 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Salzburg/Austria
Hi! I have a stupid problem with my US MBITR :cry:
I have installed a Real PRC-148 6 pin plug (the one from „toy soldier“) using this wiring scheme:

A .......... N/A ............. Power, Negative (Not wired)
B .......... Green ......... Headphone audio (single channel)
C .......... Yellow ........ PTT key
D .......... Red ............ Microphone audio
E .......... Blue ........... Speaker
F .......... N/A ............. Power, Positive (Not wired)

This happened:
  1. Thales Handset
    No RX-Audio on Handset, but MBITR-speaker worked
    Pressing Handset PTT - TX goes on, off, on, off etc... in short intervalls
  2. MSA U94 coiled + Sordin Dual Comms (modded with electret mic)
    No RX-Audio
    No TX (no reaction of PTT)

Then I found another wiring scheme, which is this one:
A-BLUE
B-GREEN
C-YELLOW
D-ORANGE
E-N/A
F-N/A

I tried it out and this is what happens now:
  1. Thales Handset
    RX-Audio woked on Handset BUT also on MBITR speaker at same time
    TX works normally
  2. MSA U94 coiled + Sordin Dual Comms (modded with electret mic)
    No RX-Audio
    No TX (no reaction of PTT)
    BUT when the radio receives a signal and I press the PTT, I can hear a static noise. This is very strange, and even more confusing!

I think there is still a problem with the wiring and I really really hope that some of you guys know how to fix this!

Cheers!

_________________
Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.
Abraham Lincoln


Last edited by aZtec on Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:08 pm 
Administrator
Administrator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:54 pm
Posts: 695
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Did the radio work with your setup before you swapped the connector?

_________________
Don´t be a beech!


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:24 am 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:16 pm
Posts: 326
Location: Czech Republic
second pinout is right, theres no wire on E most PTTs, A is ground for both mic, speaker and PTT. Check resistance on PTT pins and then compare it to resistance on same pins inside the radio.


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:31 am 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:42 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Salzburg/Austria
marre wrote:
Did the radio work with your setup before you swapped the connector?


Unfortunately I bought the radio used so I cannot personally confirm this, but the guy that I bought it from - which seems like a squared away person - says that it did work with the old connector.

Danny Jefferson wrote:
...

Could you explain a little more thoroughly what you mean, please? I'm not good in electrics stuff so i unf. don't get what you mean...

Thx for the prompt replies!!

edit: The connection between u-183 and u-229 pins definitly is there. I used a multimeter to measure the voltage on a wild combination of 2 pins on the U94s headset socket. Voltages during RX differed between ~3.5 and ~8.xx Volt.

#####win edit######

Oh sheeeet! If I was a signals officer in the military, I would have probably hung myself with a few meters of coax!!!! This is driving me insane!
Through magical reasons, completely obscure to the brain of a think-logically-or-die computer science student, the PTT + Sordin combo works without a problem now. Only difference is, that the connector was actually seated in the radio shell now, instead of having it out for testing purpose.
The only remaining problem is, that the Thales Handset doesn't turn off the radio's internal mic/speaker...Intersting info: When I plug in a Kenwood PTT at the side programming port, the radio gets it and turns off internal m./s...

_________________
Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.
Abraham Lincoln


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:21 am 
The New Guy
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:18 pm
Posts: 21
Location: Swansea
You cant use real Headsets with the That model, its due to impendence issues. i have a Thales speaker mic and everytime i click on on the PTT the radios speaker turns on. this is a known issue with the 148's. if you use peltors and etc you will have to change your wiring for a ztactical headset one to make the mic work.


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:28 am 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:42 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Salzburg/Austria
There can't be an impedance problem, at least not with the mic. The Thales uses an electret condense mic (you can read that up on Thales' website) and the TX sound level is definitly as high as with "replica" stuff. Unless there is "another" type of impedance, I can't really imagine this is the problem.

_________________
Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.
Abraham Lincoln


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:45 am 
Administrator
Administrator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:54 pm
Posts: 695
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
I would suggest to get a breadboard http://www.ecse.rpi.edu/courses/EI/breadboard.pdf and simulate a PTT on the board. Test each function at a time so you know exactly what isn't working.

_________________
Don´t be a beech!


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:21 pm 
The New Guy
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:18 pm
Posts: 21
Location: Swansea
If look on airsoftcanada forum, theres over 200pages regarding that one radio. Details on how to wire it and loads more.


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:41 pm 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:42 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Salzburg/Austria
Yea I read through that topic multiple times.
The wiring should definitly be correct, otherwise I would have no sound and mic out/input on the Handset and headset. It's just that the radio doesn't register when the handset is plugged in.
My gut feeling tells me, this might have something to do with ground pins, because that's would be the only pin that has a constant load. I can't really imagine that the radio only turns off the internal mic + speaker when a signal is present...so the only other option would be the ground wires.

Somewhere, somehow, on some forum, I read of a guy that had the same problem with the same setup, but I couldn't find it ever since!

_________________
Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.
Abraham Lincoln


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:17 pm 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:42 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Salzburg/Austria
Hi again!

I found out something: When the connector is not seated in the radio shell, the head/handsets don't work, which seems to be a lack of ground...With this knowledge I tried out the very first wiring (initial post) again, and it didn't change anything!

Also I have now rewired the headset like this:
A - Green (was Blue before)
B - Blue (was Green before)
C - Yellow
D - Red
E - N/A
F - N/A

Now I have the following situation:
Thales handset: very very silent sound from the handset itself, sound from the radio internal speaker is now muted
U94PTT + Sordin: no sound at all from the Sordin itself, but the internal speaker now outputs all the sound

Now, I have know idea what to deduct from that!

edit: Problem solved!!

A radio guy named Brooke Clarke (check his website, http://www.prc68.com/ - he has loads of information there!!) helped me out.
He told me, that a 1kOhm resistor was necessary to be soldered in parallel to the speaker.
The actual wiring was correct (as I assumed), but with this resistor soldered into my handset, everything works perfectly now!

_________________
Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.
Abraham Lincoln


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:59 am 
The New Guy
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:23 am
Posts: 27
Location: MI, USA
So the wiring scheme above is what you settled on then? Not one of the original ones from earlier in the thread? (Just wanted to clarify so I know which to try on mine)

I only ask cause myself and a few others have had the same problem with the internal speaker still activating when using the Thales hand mics.

Do you happen to have a picture of how you soldered up the resistor to your internal speaker? If so, that would be awesome as this issue is driving me nuts as well.

I also got in one of the TRI PRC-152's to compare with the US MBITR and it's looking like the 152 is going to need an overhaul as well since it not only has the same speaker issue, but has a PTT that looks to be home made by TRI and doesn't work when you use PTT switches. :roll:

_________________
LBT Dealer

ODA 561


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 10:12 am 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:42 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Salzburg/Austria
Okay that's interesting - have you gotten the TRI already?

The final wiring I used is this:

A - blue (ground)
B - green (spkr)
C - yellow (ptt)
D - red (mic)
E - n/a
F - n/a

The shell housing acts as ground aswell, so B/C/D seems to be sufficient, but IIRC the Handset requires the wired ground, so just solder it anyway.
I also had it wired B C D E once, and except for the internal muting (bc I hadn't had the res. installed - dunno if it would have worked in case I had), everything worked the same.

I luckily made a photo of the handset when it was opened up. Will post that later today.
Basically it shouldn't be hard to find it yourself: When you have the pcb in front of you, with the wire coming down towards you, at the lower left side of the board, you have a black semi-cylindrical condenser. Solder the 1kOhm resistor in parallel to that condenser and you should be gtg.

I still wonder why this handset works on some MBITRs and doesn't on others. I thought mine was a lemon, but there seem to be more with that problem.

Also, I'd be more then happy about any info on the PRC-152 ^_^

_________________
Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.
Abraham Lincoln


Last edited by aZtec on Wed Jan 16, 2013 1:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:16 pm 
Administrator
Administrator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:54 pm
Posts: 695
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
jdizzle921> Would love to get some info on the 152.

_________________
Don´t be a beech!


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:32 am 
The New Guy
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:23 am
Posts: 27
Location: MI, USA
@marre- I'll be sure to put up some info when I get a chance to write up the review for a local forum. I've been severely inactive the last few months and am just now getting back into things. :D

@aZtec- I went out and grabbed some resistors and am gonna give a go when I check out your photo as I am completely ignorant when it comes to working circuit boards and how they work. (No rush, I just want to make sure I do it correctly and copy your working mic instead of botching things up :shock: ) I uploaded a pic of one of my speaker mics below as well.

I agree with you about the mics working with some radios and not others. I have two of the Thales Hand mics for my MBITRS and they worked perfectly fine on the ToySoldier PRC-148 which in comparison to the United Star, is supposed to be the cheaper and inferior radio. I wish just one of the manufacturers would take all the feedback they hear from users off the internet, and make one radio that will work the way it's supposed to out of the box. :roll:

As for the internal radio wiring, I've had no problems with the U-283 wiring on mine so far, so I'm hoping I might have to do the Thales mic and everything will be working good. I've tested it so far with both a MSA/U-94 and a Peltor PTT switch with a pair of Comtac II's, MSA Sordins, TRI Comtac III's, (Bought em' as a 'feeler' to gauge TRI's overall quality) a Battle Rhion Bone Mic replica, and a Sonetronics H-250 handset and all transmitted and received fine.

In comparing the Thales Hand mic to the Sonetronics H-250, the 250 muted the internal MBITR speaker when connected. I suspect it worked fine because my 250 has one of the older 5-pin U-283 connectors on it, and not a 6-pin.


Image

_________________
LBT Dealer

ODA 561


Top
Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: United Star - weird wiring problems
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:12 am 
Earning his keep
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:42 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Salzburg/Austria
You see the black cylindrical thing in the lower left corner? Should be a condenser..
Just take one of your resistors, hold it to that condenser with one of the feet touching one of the condenser's feet. Then press the monitor button which deactivates squelch and puts out static noise.
It should only come out frome the speaker/mic

Where have you ordered your TRI? Because I've ordered it at boomarms and now I've seen that some shops explicitly mention "IPX7" and some ebay dude selling it at horrendous prices even wrote "mine is more expensive because it's IPX7 and theirs is PX5" - are there really different waterproof levels? anybody know more bout that?

_________________
Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power.
Abraham Lincoln


Top
Offline Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Theme created StylerBB.net & kodeki